Topic: New resource indicators

I want to summarize what i have now understand:

1. There is a conclusion to leave default_resource in world/terrains/init.lua
2. default resources are "water" and "fish" (maybe some more in future?)
3. Default resources should be displayed in the editor
4. Default resources should be removable from the map

That's right? So my statement for removing these options was bad, sorry.

Could someone summarize the usage of resource water and humidity regarding to wells/deep wells in the same way? It's hard for me to read through whole sentences

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Hmm, i don't understand one thing:

The whole story comes up, because the default resource isn't shown in the editor, so a map designer couldn't see that there is such resource. This was considered as a problem, wasn't it? To solve this problem consesus is to have the default resource visible in the editor.

If humidity is used for wells, we have water resource which isn't shown in the editor. Or should humidity and water be combined to show it?

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king_of_nowhere wrote:

humidity should be used only after water resource is exhausted. The whole thing about humidity and deep wells came up because it was noted that the presence or absence of water resource was meaningless, since wells worked fine without, so alternatives were looked to the flat 65% after water is run out.

Ah, thanks

So setting resource water on dry soil in editor would lead in game to the situation

1. Well is running fine as long resource water is present
2. If resource water is depleted, the well will be upgraded to a deep well... which couldn't mine water because dry soil has less humidity?

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I like the solutions described in summaries. But as it was mentioned before, we can't forget about old maps. Also not every map maker set water resources.

Also equations given by king_of_nowhere are good to me. Only possibility of "0%" for well is not the best in my opinion.

Another question about small/deep wells: should we consider sending a message when the water resource is depleted with small well? Like for mines?

einstein13
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einstein13 wrote:

I like the solutions described in summaries. But as it was mentioned before, we can't forget about old maps. Also not every map maker set water resources.

deep wells would produce roughly the same as wells right now, so old maps would not be affected too much, except that one would need to spend some more resources to make deep wells from the start.

Also equations given by king_of_nowhere are good to me. Only possibility of "0%" for well is not the best in my opinion.

0% is only theoretical. any buildable terrain has humidity of at least 0.1. But if you think a better equation, propose it. Just keep in mind the conditions it must satisfy: wells without water resources should have poor productivity even with high humidity; deep wells without water resources should have passable productivity even with low humidity; and deep wells with high humidity still should not work at 100%.

Another question about small/deep wells: should we consider sending a message when the water resource is depleted with small well? Like for mines?

Of course. An exhausted well will at most work at 30%, one would definitely want to upgrade it.

kaputtnik wrote:

king_of_nowhere wrote:

kaputtnik wrote:

1. [...]
2. If resource water is depleted, the well will be upgraded to a deep well... which would have mediocre yield (but never below 50%) because dry soil has less humidity?

Fixed. The equation I proposed for deep well guarantees at least 50% productivity. A wet soil will simply get a better production, but 50% is guaranteed on any soil.

And what is the difference to:

king_of_nowhere wrote:

humidity should be used only after water resource is exhausted. The whole thing about humidity and deep wells came up because it was noted that the presence or absence of water resource was meaningless, since wells worked fine without, so alternatives were looked to the flat 65% after water is run out.

50% to 65%? As i understand GunChleoc 50% could also be set right now. I believe i still haven't understand the whole story

For me it seems that the idea of humidity and deep wells brings huge complications to the engine and game play. I am not sure if this is worth the effort.

Making a deep well needs also some new graphics, and there is currently no one who could do this

I proposed the equation (50 + 50 * (average humidity in a range of 2))%. Consider that equation. If humidity all around is 0 (limit, impossible case because no buildable terrain has a humidity of 0) then the productivity is 50%. If humidity all around is 1 (limit, impossible case because no buildable terrain has a humidity of 1, so it still satisfy the condition I gave to einstein) then the productivity is 100%. Real productivity will vary between 60% and 90% depending on humidity. Really, that equation seem very straightforward to me; I don't understand what is it that you're not understanding. There is a fixed component of 50%, plus another component depending on humidity, so the productivity of the well is 50% + something depending on humidity. If you can't see that by the equation, you have to take my word for it.

The fact that it brings complications to programming and that we don't have a graphic to do it is a valid complaint. but hey, we were making a wishlist. we thought it would be pretty if wells didn't produce that much without water resources, so that people would have an actual reason to send geologists looking for water. We thought it would be cool if the production was somewhat dependent on terrain humidity. We thought that even if no water resources are set and the land is very dry the wells should still work to a reasonable extent. my idea of deep wells is one way to satisfy all those conditions. We don't have to do it. We don't have to satisfy any of those conditions. We can leave wells the way they are, of course. I think deep wells with humidity-dependent productivity would be the coolest idea, but be free to propose something else.

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